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skunk-works-digest Thursday, May 22 1997 Volume 06 : Number 052
In this issue:
Defections
Re: MiGs in the US
ER-2
Defections
X-36
Re: ER-2
Re: MiGs in the US and Defections
Re: ER-2
Nellis YF-22A
Re: Nellis YF-22A
See the end of the digest for information on subscribing to the
skunk-works or skunk-works-digest mailing lists and on how to
retrieve back issues.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Date: Mon, 19 May 1997 15:30:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: David Lednicer <
[email protected]>
Subject: Defections
Some time ago, a Canadian fellow (whose name escapes me) and I put
together a list of know defections. Since Andreas has gotten involved, I
thought I would throw this list up for discussion. I apologize for the
length of the lines.
Captures/Defections of Sino/Soviet Aircraft
Date Aircraft From Notes
Jun-51 Mig-15 N. Korea Recovered from sea by Royal Navy. To USA.
17-May-49 La-11 Landed in Sweden from navigational Error.
21-Sep-53 MiG-15bis N. Korea Flown to Kimpo S. Korea by Lt. Ro Kun Suk. Test flown by USAF as T2-3000. Now in USAF museum.
Il-10 N. Korea Captured by USA.
Yak-9D N. Korea Captured by USA. Test flown as T2-3002 by USAF.
Mil-4 Cuba Defection to USA in 1960s. Now in US Army museum at Fort Rucker.
Il-14 Captured in Aden by RAF after mistaken landing.
Yak-18 N. Korea Captured by USA. Now in NASM.
05-Mar-53 MiG-15bis Poland Defection to Borholm Island Denmark. Aircraft returned March 22nd.
Mar-64 Yak-11U Force landed in Cyprus during ferry flight to Egypt. Flown in UK as G-AYAK.
An-2 Rumania Defection to Austria.
An-2 Cuba Defection to USA.
An-14 Guinea Captured by Portugese Guinea
An-2 N. Korea Defection to S. Korea. Now on display.
12-Aug-68 Mig-17F Syria 2 aircraft landed at Betzet Israel in error.
Yak-18A E. Germany Defection to Bornholm Island, Denmark
19-Jan-61 Yak-11 Egypt Defection to Israel.
1979 Su-20 Egypt Given to PR of China.
1979 MiG-23 Egypt Given to PR of China.
MiG-23 Egypt Several given to USA.
La-7UTI USSR Defection to Turkey
05-Oct-69 MiG-17 Cuba Defection to USA by Lt. Eduardo Jimenez. Aircraft returned.
1965 MiG-17 Syria To Israel. Flight tested by IDF/AF.
06-Sep-76 MiG-25 USSR Defection to Hakodate Japan by Lt. Victor Belenko. Aircraft returned.
05-Jun-67 MiG-21 Algeria 3 aircraft landed at El Arish after airfield was overrun by Israel.
16-Aug-66 MiG-21 Iraq Defection to Israel. Aircraft flown in USA. Now on display at IDF/AF museum.
1965 MiG-17 Syria 6 landed by mistake in Israel. To USA.
12-Jan-60 MiG-15 PR of China Exploded on force landing at Ilan, Taiwan.
15-Sep-61 An-2 PR of China Flown to S. Korea.
03-Mar-62 MiG-15bis PR of China Defection to Taoyuan AB Taiwan by Lt. Liu Cheng-Sze. Now on display at Pintung AB.
11-Nov-66 Il-28 PR of China Crashed at Taoyuan AB Taiwan.
07-Jul-77 F-6 (MiG-19) PR of China Defection to Taiwan.
Su-7 Egypt Captured by Israel.
18-Jul-80 MiG-23 Libya Crashed in mountains near Castelsilano, Italy.
11-Feb-81 MiG-23 Libya Defection to Maleme AB, Crete Greece. Aircraft returned February 14.
01-Aug-68 MiG-17 Syria 9 aircraft to Iraq.
01-Aug-68 MiG-21 Syria 3 aircraft to Iraq.
1976 MiG-23 Syria To Iraq.
26-Apr-81 Mi-8 Afghanistan To Quetta Airport, Pakistan.
03-May-81 Let Z-37 Czechoslovakia To Austria.
1967 MiG-17 Egypt Captured in damaged condition by Israel at Bir Gif Gafa AB.
31-Oct-56 MiG-15 Egypt Captured in damaged condition by Israel after being shot down. Displayed at Hatzor AB.
1965 MiG-17 Syria 7 aircraft forced to land in Israel. 3 aircraft and 5 pilots returned.
01-Apr-82 An-2 Poland Defected to Austria.
Jun-82 Yak-12 Poland Defected to Austria.
08-Jul-81 MiG-17 Mozambique Defected to South Africa. Aircraft returned in November.
19-Oct-82 An-2 Poland Defected to Sweden. Aircraft returned.
16-Oct-82 F-6 (MiG-19) PR of China To S. Korea. Pilot Wu June-Chien to Taiwan.
08-Feb-83 Mi-2 Poland Defected to Sweden. Aircraft returned.
25-Feb-83 MiG-19 N. Korea Defected to S. Korea.
07-Aug-83 F-7 PR of China Defected to S. Korea.
14-Nov-83 J-5 (MiG-17) PR of China Defected to Taiwan.
27-May-83 J-6 (MiG-19) PR of China Crash during attempt to defect.
1955 MiG-15bis USSR Forced landed in W. Germany from navigational error.
13-Jul-85 Mi-24 USSR 2 aircraft defected to Pakistan. Aircraft to USA.
24-Aug-85 Il-28 PR of China Crashed on landing in Taiwan.
Mi-8 Syria Captured by Israel.
20-Feb-85 F-6 (MiG-19) PR of China Defected to S. Korea.
25-Jul-84 An-2 Poland Defected to Everod Airfield, Kristianstad Sweden. Aircraft returned.
23-Mar-83 An-2 Poland Defected to Everod Airfield, Kristianstad Sweden. Aircraft returned.
Mar-86 J-6 (MiG-19) PR of China Defected to S. Korea.
23-Oct-86 MiG-21 Afghanistan Defected to Pakistan
04-Mar-87 Mi-2 Czechoslovakia Defected to W. Germany.
20-Oct-86 F-6 (MiG-19) PR of China Defected to S. Korea.
Mar-87 Mi-25 Libya Captured by Chad at Quadi-Duom. To France, USA.
14-Aug-89 MiG-17F Hungary Crash landed during defection, near Udine, Italy
22-Sep-84 An-26 Afghanistan Defected to Miranshah, Pakistan. Aircraft put into Pakistani service.
Oct-73 Mi-8 Egypt Captured by Israel in flying condition.
May-89 MiG-29 USSR Defection to Turkey. Aircraft returned.
14-Dec-88 MiG-21 Angola Landed in Namibia. Flown to South Africa.
08-Dec-88 MiG-21MF Afghanistan Flown to Miram Shah AB, Pakistan.
26-Apr-89 Mi-25 Sudan Flown to Aswan Airport, Egypt.
11-Oct-89 MiG-23MLD Syria Defection to Meggidio, Israel. Aircraft flown by IDF/AF.
20-Nov-83 Su-7 Afghanistan Crashed on landing during defection to Dal Bandin AB, Pakistan.
25-Mar-84 MiG-17 Afghanistan Crashed on landing during defection to Mushcab AB, Pakistan.
16-Jul-84 Mi-25 Afghanistan Defection to Miran Shah Pakistan. Aircraft in Pakistani service.
03-Oct-87 Mi-4 Afghanistan 2 defections to Chihal Pakistan. Aircraft returned.
08-Aug-88 MiG-21 Afghanistan Defection to Parachinar Pakistan.
03-Jul-89 Mi-24 Afghanistan Defection to Kica AB Pakistan. Aircraft in Pakistani service.
1987 Mi-24 USSR Landed in Pakistan.
06-Jul-89 Su-22 Afghanistan Defection to Peshawar Pakistan.
29-Oct-89 MiG-21bis Afghanistan Defection to Peshawar Pakistan.
1989 F-6 (MiG-19) PR of China Defected to Fujan Province, Taiwan.
Su-7 Afghanistan Defection to Pakistan.
20-Mar-91 MiG-23 Cuba Defection to USA.
26-May-91 L-39 Ethiopia To Dijibouti. Returned August 8.
26-May-91 An-12 Ethiopia 2 to Dijibouti. Returned August 8.
26-May-91 Mi-8 Ethiopia 7 to Dijibouti. Returned August 8.
26-May-91 MiG-23BN Ethiopia 3 to Dijibouti. Returned August 8.
26-May-91 Mi-24 Ethiopia 3 to Dijibouti. Returned August 8.
26-May-91 Mi-35 Ethiopia 3 to Dijibouti. Returned August 8.
07-Nov-91 Mi-14 Germany 2 Given to USA. To USN.
08-Jul-92 MiG-23 Libya Defection to Maleme AB, Crete Greece. Aircraft returned February 14.
15-Sep-61 Y-5 PR of China Defected to Taiwan. Now in museum.
1985 Su-20 Egypt Given to W. Germany.
MiG-23 Germany 5 given to USA.
Su-22 Germany 2 given to USA.
MiG-29 Germany Supplied to USA.
Feb-91 MiG-25 Iraq Captured by USA in heavily damaged condition.
Feb-91 Su-25 Iraq 2 captured in damaged condition by USA.
1993 MiG-21 Ethiopa Known to be in Israel.
- -------------------------------------------------------------------
David Lednicer | "Applied Computational Fluid Dynamics"
Analytical Methods, Inc. | email:
[email protected]
2133 152nd Ave NE | tel: (206) 643-9090
Redmond, WA 98052 USA | fax: (206) 746-1299
------------------------------
Date: Mon, 19 May 1997 23:13:46 -0400 (EDT)
From: Wei-Jen Su <
[email protected]>
Subject: Re: MiGs in the US
I am not sure, but, what about Ka-50??
In the book "The Osprey Encyclopedia of Russian Aircraft
1875-1995" by Bill Gunston say the following in pag. 144:
"Order for small evaluation batch (of Ka-50) by US Special Force
reported 93".
Please, correct me if I am wronge. I read something like this also
in AvLeek.
May the Force be with you
Su Wei-Jen
E-mails:
[email protected]
[email protected]
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 May 1997 14:30:02 -0700
From:
[email protected]
Subject: ER-2
USAFnews wrote:> &
> 970614. NASA research aircraft soars to new heights
>
> HOUSTON (AFNS) -- A NASA ER-2 aircraft, complete with a full array of
> science instrument packages, recently conducted its first operational
> mission at an altitude of 70,000 feet, a key region for atmospheric
> research.
>
> The vehicle currently is on deployment to Alaska for missions over the
> North Pole in support of a project known as POLARIS, short for
> Photochemistry of Ozone Loss in the Arctic Region In Summer. NASA has
> two such aircraft in its ER-2 fleet based at the Agency's Ames Research
> Center, Mountain View, Calif. The ER-2 is a civilian version of the Air
> Force's U-2 aerial reconnaissance plane.
>
> A program to modernize the aircraft by making them lighter, more fuel
> efficient and more productive was completed recently. Over the next
> year, these improvements will significantly increase the size of science
> payloads and enhance the altitude performance of the ER-2s in support of
> NASA's Mission to Planet Earth enterprise.
>
> Earth scientists also are excited about the enhanced capability. "It is
> really critical that we have access to consistent measurements at this
> key altitude, which is an intermediate region between aerosol
> particle-driven processes measured by standard aircraft-based sensors
> and gas-phase processes monitored by orbiting satellites," said Dr.
> Michael Kurylo, manager of the Upper Atmosphere Research Program at NASA
> Headquarters, Washington, DC.
>
> The POLARIS mission is seeking to understand the fundamental chemistry
> that dominates the naturally occurring seasonal reduction of ozone over
> the pole in the course of the Arctic summer. Many of the chemical
> reactions in which project scientists are interested in occur at
> altitudes in the 75,000-foot range.
>
> Now, even a fully loaded ER-2 can operate approximately 2,500 feet
> higher than previously possible due to lower fuel requirements and
> lighter aircraft weight. This increased altitude capability permits
> extension of in-place measurements for validating and upgrading existing
> models of the upper atmosphere. (Courtesy of NASA News Service)
======================================================================
patrick cullumber
[email protected]
------------------------------
Date: Tue, 20 May 1997 17:39:06 -0700 (PDT)
From: David Lednicer <
[email protected]>
Subject: Defections
> An excellent posting, but now I'm curious, is there a similar list of
> aircraft that the other side got from us, by various means? I'm sure
> there were not many defections.
The only aircraft I am aware of that defected are:
- - A F-86 flown to PR of China by a R of China pilot
- - A F-5E flown to PR of China by a R of China pilot
They also had the opportunity to look at:
- - Various F-5As, F-5Es, A-37s, C-123s, C-130s, UH-1s, CH-47s, etc.
captured when R of Vietnam fell. It is established that one RVN F-5E
ended up in Poland and one RVN F-5E and one A-37 in Czechoslovakia.
- - Whatever might have been left behind when Cambodia fell.
- - Iranian F-14s, F-4Ds, F-4Es, F-5Es, P-3Fs, etc. after the Shah fell.
- - Libyan F-5As and Mirage IIIs and Vs.
- - Ethiopian F-5As and F-5Es.
- - Iraqi Hawker Hunters, Super Etendards and Mirage F1s.
- - Yugoslavian F-84s and F-86s.
- - A couple of Fiat G-91s left behind in Angola and Mozambique when the
Portugese withdrew.
- - Indianian Hunters, Gnats and Canberras.
- - The two Vertol 44s and two Sikorsky S-58s sold to the USSR in 1958.
- - Let's not forget the RR Nenes and Derwents sold to the USSR in 1946!
- - The famous GE CF6 that dissapeared from Kabul when the USSR invaded
Afghanistan in 1979.
- - Aerospatiale Pumas and Alouttes from the Romanian assembly line.
- - AIM-9 Sidewinders recovered by PR of China and stolen from FR of
Germany.
- - Wreckage from aircraft shot down over PR of Vietnam, PR of Korea, Egypt,
Syria, Angola, Iraq, Lebanon (an A-6 and an A-7 in 1982), PR of China and
the USSR itself.
- -------------------------------------------------------------------
David Lednicer | "Applied Computational Fluid Dynamics"
Analytical Methods, Inc. | email:
[email protected]
2133 152nd Ave NE | tel: (206) 643-9090
Redmond, WA 98052 USA | fax: (206) 746-1299
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 May 97 13:54:02 EDT
From: JOHN SZALAY <
[email protected]>
Subject: X-36
OK I know its not a product of LMSW, but since its SO slow around the list
lately. heres the latest release on the X-36.
- --------------------------------------------------------------------------
RELEASE: 97-106
REMOTELY-PILOTED TAILLESS AIRCRAFT COMPLETES FIRST FLIGHT
A NASA/McDonnell Douglas remotely piloted, tailless aircraft
successfully completed its first flight on May 17 at NASA's Dryden
Flight Research Center, Edwards, CA. The lack of vertical tails
greatly enhances the stealthy characteristics of the airplane, and
holds promise for greater agility than is currently available in
existing military fighter aircraft.
Called the X-36, the subscale research aircraft lifted off
from Rogers Dry Lake at 7:08 a.m., PDT. The aircraft flew for five
minutes and reached an altitude of approximately 4,900 feet. An
additional 24 test flights of the X-36 are scheduled at Dryden
during the next six months.
show what the fighter aircraft of the future will look like," said
Rod Bailey, X-36 program manager. When we saw this airplane lift
off, we saw the shape of airplanes to come."
NASA's Ames Research Center, Moffett Field, CA, leads the X-
36 program, and has technical responsiblity for continued
development of some of the critical technologies needed for future
tailless, stealthy fighter aircraft.
There are two 28-percent-scale X-36s, which are remotely
piloted jets built by the McDonnell Douglas Corporation's Phantom
Works division in St. Louis, MO, and are designed to fly without
the traditional vertical and horizontal tails found on most
aircraft. Each aircraft measures 18 feet long, 3 feet high, has a
10-foot wing span, and weighs 1,250 pounds. Each aircraft is
powered by a Williams Research F112 turbofan engine that provides
700 pounds of thrust.
The X-36 aircraft are remotely controlled by a pilot in a
ground station cockpit, complete with a heads-up display. The
pilot-in-the-loop approach eliminates the need for expensive and
complex autonomous flight control systems. The design reduces
weight and drag of the aircraft and explores new flight control
technologies. The aircraft use split ailerons to provide yaw
control, as well as raising and lowering in a normal fashion to
provide roll control. The X-36 also incorporates a thrust
vectoring system.
"The flight control system functioned flawlessly and we look
forward to subsequent flights to demonstrate the full range of
manuverability of the aircraft," said Mark Sumich, X-36 project
manager.
"We knew within five to ten seconds into the flight that we
had a good flying airplane," said Gary Jennings, McDonnell Douglas
X-36 program manager. "Flying in a simulator is one thing, but
until you actually fly the airplane, you don't really know how it
will handle. Today we found out that it handled extremely well."
NASA Ames and McDonnell Douglas developed the technologies
required for a tailless fighter beginning in 1989. In 1993,
McDonnell Douglas proposed the remotely piloted aircraft
technology demonstration to validate the technologies in a real
flight environment. In 1994, McDonnell Douglas began fabrication
of the two aircraft in their rapid prototyping facility in St.
Louis. The project was jointly funded under a roughly 50/50 cost-
sharing arrangement between NASA and McDonnell Douglas. The
combined program cost for the development, fabrication, and flight
testing of the two prototype aircraft is approximately $20 million.
"The first flight went very well; it was just textbook
perfect," said Larry Walker, X-36 Project pilot. "It was a nice
takeoff and the handling was great. I knew instantly that it was
a nice flying airplane. I see no obstacles in the future for this
type of technology."
-end-
Photos are available from NASA Ames Research Center's Public
Affairs' homepage at URL:
http://ccf.arc.nasa.gov/dx
and also are available from the NASA Dryden Photo Archive on the
World Wide Web at URL:
http://www.dfrc.nasa.gov/PhotoServer/photoserver.html
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 May 1997 13:40:19 -0400
From:
[email protected] (GREG WEIGOLD)
Subject: Re: ER-2
Is this what they're really doing up there????
Sorry, couldn't resist!
Greg Weigold
______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________
USAFnews wrote:> &
> 970614. NASA research aircraft soars to new heights
>
> HOUSTON (AFNS) -- A NASA ER-2 aircraft, complete with a full array of
<<SNIP>> (Courtesy of NASA News Service)
======================================================================
patrick cullumber
[email protected]
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 May 1997 22:59:19 -0400 (EDT)
From: Kathryn & Andreas Gehrs-Pahl <
[email protected]>
Subject: Re: MiGs in the US and Defections
I included in my list some German 'umlaute', which apparently didn't make it
correctly through the 7-bit ASCII mailer.
The aircraft type for FE-4611 and FE-4612 should read Bue 181 (Bu"), short
for Buecker (Bu"cker), while LSK stands for Luftstreitkraefte (kra"fte).
I guess I neglected to point out, that the ISTM (Intelligence Squadron's
Threat Museum) is also located at Nellis AFB, Las Vegas, NV.
Additional information and corrections, like c/n, usage, current location,
or more aircraft entries, are very welcome!
Regarding David's (great!) list of defected/captured aircraft, I like to
add that the (2) former Egyptian Su-20 'Fitter-C', which were used by WTD-61
(Wehrtechnische Dienststelle 61), at Manching, Bavaria, Germany, received
LW serials 98+61 and 98+62, respectively.
Also, shouldn't the Iraqi aircraft, flown to Iran in Jan/Feb 1991, be added
to the lists, both, the Russian MiGs and Suchois, as well as the French
Mirages?
To the aircraft 'transfers' from west to east, I would like to add the T-33A
in Albania, and of course all the U-2s and other aircraft, shot down over the
FSU and the PRC, the B-29s, and Lend Lease aircraft, as well as many German
aircraft, which were kept or captured after the end of W.W.II by the Soviets.
Regarding the alleged sale of Ka-50 'Hokum' attack helicopters to the US
Special Operation Forces, mentioned by Wei-Jen Su <
[email protected]>:
According to World Air Power Journal (WAPJ) Vol.19, Winter 1994, (which every
Skunk Works fan should have, because of the pretty good F-117A article), none
of the 8 aircraft, supposed to be acquired through Group Vector, the (then)
worldwide Ka-50 marketing company, were ever delivered. The reason was
apparently that Kamov didn't have any Ka-50, besides the prototypes, and had
just lied about their availability. The second rumored customer, Greece,
didn't get any either.
- -- Andreas
PS: The digest version of my list looked even worse, with all those characters
changed to "=HexCode". Sorry for that -- I don't know why that happened!
- --- ---
Andreas & Kathryn Gehrs-Pahl E-Mail:
[email protected]
313 West Court St. #305 or:
[email protected]
Flint, MI 48502-1239
Tel: (810) 238-8469 WWW URL:
http://www.umcc.umich.edu/~schnars/
- --- ---
------------------------------
Date: Wed, 21 May 1997 23:04:04 -0400 (EDT)
From: Kathryn & Andreas Gehrs-Pahl <
[email protected]>
Subject: Re: ER-2
I wrote:
>* ER-2 = not a real military designation; "ER" standing for "Earth
> Resource" aircraft; 2 airframes built for NASA ARC, and 1 TR-1A
> modified after a ground collision and on loan to NASA ARC; all
> ER-2s will be re-engined with F118-GE-101 engines, but probably
> will not be re-designated;
The last statement is actually wrong. Looking through my Lockheed Star
magazines, I found a small article in Vol.6, No.11, from November 22, 1996,
on page 4, which included a photo of ER-2S "NASA 706" in its new livery.
The article states that the first ER-2S (Article 063, USAF serial '80-1063',
NASA '706') was delivered back to Ames on November 8, 1996, and that a 2nd
NASA ER-2S was to be completed in March 1997. The aircraft were definitely
re-designated. No word about the 3rd ER-2, though.
I don't know if the second ER-2S would be the former TR-1A (Article 069,
USAF '80-1069', NASA '708') or the second original ER-2 (Article 097, USAF
'80-1097', NASA '709'), which was in July 1995 modified to carry the NASA
'Starlink' satellite link in a dorsal pod, which is very similar to the
USAF 'Senior Span' satellite link pod. Maybe the Starlink aircraft will be
modified later?
Sorry for the misinformation regarding the designation change.
- -- Andreas
- --- ---
Andreas & Kathryn Gehrs-Pahl E-Mail:
[email protected]
313 West Court St. #305 or:
[email protected]
Flint, MI 48502-1239
Tel: (810) 238-8469 WWW URL:
http://www.umcc.umich.edu/~schnars/
- --- ---
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 May 1997 00:09:09 -0400 (EDT)
From: Kathryn & Andreas Gehrs-Pahl <
[email protected]>
Subject: Nellis YF-22A
Richard W. Anderson <
[email protected]> wrote:
>I've now had time to look at some of my photos from Nellis and the YF-22 was
>painted with the serial 86-022 and it also had the Nellis 'WA' tail code.
The new AirForces Monthly (AFM), No. 111, June 1997, has a photo of the
aircraft on display at Nellis AFB, sporting not only the black-and-yellow
checkered tail band, 'WA' tail code, and USAF FY-serial '86-022' on its
tail fins, but also a Pratt&Whitney (PW) logo on the port air-intake. The
corresponding text reads:
"Other aircraft worthy of note include Lockheed-Martin's YF-22A '86-0022'
which arrived from the plant at Marietta;"
The USAF FY-serial '86-0022' belongs of course to another Lockheed aircraft
from Marietta -- a C-5B, c/n 500-0108 -- the 108th C-5 and 27th C-5B built.
I don't know if this was really the first prototype, which actually had the
General Electric (GE) engines installed, and which was used by Lockheed
Martin in Marietta, GA, for Engineering and Manufacturing Development (EMD)
work, and which apparently didn't receive an official USAF serial, or if it
was actually the second prototype, which had PW engines, and which was used
as a pole model for RCS (Radar Cross Section) tests, after it crashed at
Edwards AFB, while carrying (the wrong?) USAF serial '87-0701' on its tail
(instead of the correct serial '87-0700').
The usage of wrong or 'garbled' serials on USAF aircraft is nothing new, even
though it's seldom nowadays. The latest examples are the re-activated USAF
SR-71As, like Article 2022, USAF serial '64-17971', which originally carried
the tail number '17971' as non-standard tail marking. It now sports the ACC
(Air Combat Command)-style (but wrong!) tail number 'BB 17-971', instead of
the correct 'BB 64-971'.
When the current tail number style was introduced during the Vietnam war,
several aircraft wore such 'garbled' tail markings. For example, F-4C-19-MC,
USAF FY-serial '63-7544' originally had '37544' on its tail, according to the
old system, and was repainted as 'FP 37-544', instead of 'FP 63-544', because
the painter didn't have a clue that the two small digits were supposed to
represent the Fiscal Year part of the serial, while the three bigger digits
were supposed to be the last three digits of the serial.
It is of course clear that this F-4C Phantom II was not a W.W.II veteran,
nor was any SR-71A ordered in 1917.
- -- Andreas
- --- ---
Andreas & Kathryn Gehrs-Pahl E-Mail:
[email protected]
313 West Court St. #305 or:
[email protected]
Flint, MI 48502-1239
Tel: (810) 238-8469 WWW URL:
http://www.umcc.umich.edu/~schnars/
- --- ---
------------------------------
Date: Thu, 22 May 1997 00:03:26 -0500
From: Albert H Dobyns <
[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Nellis YF-22A
Kathryn & Andreas Gehrs-Pahl wrote:
>
> snipped a bunch
> The latest examples are the re-activated USAF
> SR-71As, like Article 2022, USAF serial '64-17971', which originally carried
> the tail number '17971' as non-standard tail marking. It now sports the ACC
> (Air Combat Command)-style (but wrong!) tail number 'BB 17-971', instead of
> the correct 'BB 64-971'.
SR-71 numbering system has always been something of a
puzzle to me. Just about every book and magazine I have
lists AF serial numbers for the Blackbirds as 64-179xx
and the tail numbers were always 179xx. But the first
digit, 1, used to be the last digit of the fiscal year
the plane was ordered (or maybe a different word is
more accurate). BUT I have copies of various SR-71
maintenance summaries and planes are always identified
as 6179xx. There is no '4' between the '6' and '1'!!
I do have a copy of an old magazine that lists the
SR-71 numbers the same way. But somewhere along the
way the numbering scheme was changed to 64-179xx yet
I haven't found anything in writing that explains
this. It seems to me to be an inconsistency that
should be possible to settle on one numbering system.
But I guess by now it's a little late to be worrying
about it now.
Puzzled Al
>
>
> It is of course clear that this F-4C Phantom II was not a W.W.II veteran,
> nor was any SR-71A ordered in 1917.
>
> -- Andreas
>
> --- ---
> Andreas & Kathryn Gehrs-Pahl E-Mail:
[email protected]
> 313 West Court St. #305 or:
[email protected]
> Flint, MI 48502-1239
> Tel: (810) 238-8469 WWW URL:
http://www.umcc.umich.edu/~schnars/
> --- ---
------------------------------
End of skunk-works-digest V6 #52
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